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Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 20 Mar 2010, 00:27
por SatM
Hola Jose (J.Luis) y forer@s,

también hay un análisis del ROS MM en el Blog del creador del SA (SergUA6):

http://signals-analysis.blogspot.com/20 ... modem.html

Incluyo algunas imagenes de sonogramas, ACF y representación espectral (144 saltos !!!)

Imagen

Imagen

Imagen

Imagen


En lo que respecta a la polémica con la ARRL y FCC, afortunadamente, parece que el tema está más calmado

http://rosmodem.wordpress.com/2010/03/1 ... ewing-ros/

"CIMS00002417593 – Request for clarification of new amateur radio digital mode‏
You are receiving this email in response to your inquiry to the FCC.
Thank you for contacting the FCC Consumer Center.
Because your inquiry requests a determination as to whether the system you have developed complies with the amateur service rules, your inquiry has been sent to the staff that administers these rules.

Representative Number : TSR41 "

Jose Alberto sigue depurando y ampliando, la versión del ROS MM va por la 2.8.0 (+ lo que se está "cocinando"), como siempre, en

http://rosmodem.wordpress.com/

ROS Twitter:
http://twitter.com/rosfsk

También nuevas versiones de manuales y descripciones técnicas ..

Manual ROS MM en inglés v1.1

Descripción técnica ROS MM en inglés v1.1

Las frecuencias en las que se puede probar (con el WebSDR mejor en 4 Khz) están aquí:

http://www.mediafire.com/?k12zqdyzyjz

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 20 Mar 2010, 07:37
por J.Luis
Buenas noches Satm y foro :
Como casi siempre llegas un poco mas alla con tu informacion ,todo bien completo y ordenado .
Cuando busco informacion sobre algo antes de comenzar el rastreo me paso por este foro para ver si
Satm ya busco ,hi .
No se como lo haces ,pero es un placer leerte y comprobar lo profundo que escavas buscando info.
Puedo decir al resto del foro que yo tuve ayuda con respecto a postear informacion sobre ROS en
radioscanner.ru y recibir info de los analistas rusos y tu solito has llegado mas lejos .
Me estare haciendo viejo :?:

Saludos cordiales y 73

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 22 Mar 2010, 05:42
por J.Luis
ROS versus Olivia:

THE ROS NUMBERS
21 March, 2010 by José Alberto Nieto Ros
In the ROS User Guide the author says: “ROS is designed to fully optimize the power available and make contacts in the toughest conditions, for HF, EME or Meteor Scatter”.

Some hams try to compare ROS16 with other modes that are two or three times slower with the aim of obtaining their own conclusions.
That shows that they have little or no knowledge about the fundamentals of a digital communications system.

To know what numbers we are talking we are going to compare two systems operating at 150 characters per minute: ROS 2250-8 vs OLIVIA 32/1000

ROS 2250-8 -19dB

RX8: <12:43 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:44 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:45 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>

OLIVIA 32/1000 -19dB

ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed.
ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed.
ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed.




ROS 2250-8 -20dB

RX8: <12:48 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:49 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:51 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>

OLIVIA 32/1000 -20dB

[?rZOS 9F Mode cve been desi&ned to get QSO'6 of3r a multipath channel usng the
inimum power for a character rate fcxe5%O.{L&$
ROS HF Mdes have been desi&ned to get QSO's ofer a multipath channel ysing the minimum power for a character rate fcxe5.XO.
ROS HF Mdes have been desi&ned to get QSO's ofer a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fcxe5.mO*




ROS 2250-8 -21dB

RX8: <12:52 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO's over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:53 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO's over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:54 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO's over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>

OLIVIA 32/1000 -21dB

wUeOSMF Modes 3ave been esigned t get QSO's ove mslWipath channel usigjthe minimum power f9r a chagVSter rate fixed.
ROtMF Modes 3ave been e"igned get QSO's ove mltipath channel usigjthe minimum powe( f9r a chagaSter rate fixed.
5OtMF Modes ae been e"igned get QSO's ove mltipah chInnel usigithe minimum powu( fFr a chagaSter rate fixed.




ROS 2250-8 -22dB

RX8: <12:56 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO's over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:58 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO's over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <12:59 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO's over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>

OLIVIA 32/1000 -22dB

s a# ,Sn dOCgnkd$o CeC QSO'sHover a mulrSah cPanel u5in NeRmXni]uL [w_>Gm!o-?Eac*0rtrteKixed.
$$4.Ks a# ,Sn dOCgnkd$o geC QSO'sHover a mulrSah cPannel u5i( eRmXnium [w_>Gm!o-?Eac*0rtrtefixed.
a# ,Sn dOCgnkdto CeC QSO'sHover a mulrSah cPanel u5i! NeRmXni]uL P[w_>pm!o-?ECac*0rtrteKixed.




ROS 2250-8 -23dB

RX8: <13:01 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <13:02 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <13:03 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>

OLIVIA 32/1000 -23dB

(garbage CHARACTERS)




ROS 2250-8 -24dB

RX8: <13:05 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character Lte fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <13:06 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character Lte fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <13:07 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>

OLIVIA32/1000 -24dB

(garbage CHARACTERS)




ROS 2250-8 -25dB

RX8: <13:19 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <13:20 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the miniBï power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>
RX8: <13:21 UTC> <0,0 Hz> ROS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s over a multipath channel using the minimum power for a character rate fixed. <STOP>

OLIVIA 32/1000 -25dB

(garbage CHARACTERS)




ROS 2250-8 -26dB

RX8: <13:24 UTC> <0,0 Hz> iOS HF Modes have been designed to get QSO’s oveooe ¶oetipath channel using the minimum power fM chareêer o ve fte ad. <STOP>
RX8: <13:25 UTC> <0,0 Hz> a OS HF Modes have been designew O get QSO’s oveooe Ä path 1=nnel using the minimum power ¨¿chareêer o ve fteeed. <STOP>
RX8: <13:26 UTC> <0,0 Hz> a OS HF Modes have been designew O get QSO’s over W coetipath uhannel using the minimum power Õn¿chareêer o ve fteeed. <STOP>

OLIVIA 32/1000 -26dB

(garbage CHARACTERS)




ROS 2250-8 -27dB

(nO SYNC)

OLIVIA 32/1000 -27dB

(garbage CHARACTERS)


CONCLUSIONS:

You can see the difference between both systems is about 5dbs (3.16 in natural units). This means that ROS8 need 3.16 times less power than OLIVIA 32/1000 to establish a QSO to 150 characters/minute.

In my honest opinion, and in the opinion of many hams, a mode with these numbers that optimize the power in 5 dBs may be all but illegal, much less in the land of Bernard Sklar. In fact, ROS is not more Spread Spectrum than OLIVIA, DOMINO or CHIP64, because neither varies the oscillator frequency of the station. All these are baseband systems generated with the sound card.

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 25 Mar 2010, 18:48
por J.Luis
ROS se destapa :lol:

On March 28 at 00:00:01 UTC, new improvements will be incorporated to ROS 16 HF Modes for 2250 and 500 Hz. It will improve even more the robutness again HF slow fadding and interferences. This possibility also that two stations can transmit with ROS 16 at the same time, however, that is not the main of ROS HF modes. The real objective of these improvements is to optimize the power of the rig (QRP communications).

In the case of ROS 8 bauds these improvements are already available (only we have to wait people with v2.8.0 change his old version).

Changes have been programmed previously in the software to avoid the chaos with the different versions. You just have to wait for D-Day and H-Hour and if you are using latest version you should not have problems during the transition from the old to the new protocol.

To celebrate this new change, I have prepared a new version that measures the S / N Rate and that allows us to estimate how much power you can reduce without losing the link. It will ready on March 28.

Thank you all for experimenting with ROS and contribute to its development. Enjoy it

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Que esta sucediendo en la FCC y la ARRL??????.

http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2010/03/18/11396/?nc=1

Tendra algo que ver "The Man of the Aljorra " en el tema???? ;)

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 05 Abr 2010, 06:49
por J.Luis
Hola foreros:
Seguimos con el tema ROS


Belgium-New Zealand with 3 Watts
4 April, 2010 by José Alberto Nieto Ros
¡Great QSO! On March 3, ON3WP could establish contact with ZL1RS using a vertical antenna and 3 Watts on 20 meters.

(With the ROS new versions, it is recommend to select 8 bauds for that purpose).

Congratulations for the QSO and thanks for the info.

HELLO JOSE,

GREAT CONTACT 05/03/2010 – 08H29 IN ROS 16 PWR 3 Wtt ICOM 703 ANT VERT 12 AVQ GRND ON 14.103 WITH BOB ZL1RS DISTANCE MY LOCATOR JO10UJ LOCATOR ZL1RS RF64US = 18.170 KM IN 3Wtt

JOSE CONGRATULATION FOR THE PROGRAM ROS GOOD GOOD

73’s DE SERGE ON3WP/QRP

Espero que los emisoristas os animeis a probar ;)

73 y saludos

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 08 Abr 2010, 21:44
por J.Luis
Ah !! quisiera preguntaros algo:
Estoy recibiendo desde el SDR de Twente y para decodificar ROS utilizo
2 tarjetas de sonido en mi portatil,la interior para recibir Twente
,la USB para decodificar ROS .
Tengo que llevar la señal desde salida auriculares del portatil a
la entrada linea de la tarjeta USB a traves de un cable y un adaptador
atenuador.
Mi SO es un windows XP desatendido SP2 y lo que quiero es no tener
que andar con cables por fuera .
Intente instalar un vac bajado del servidor ,pero no va
Hay alguna forma de hacer esto sin tener que usar tanto telar?
Me falta algo de Windows que haga esta funcion?

Saludos para todos y QAP

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 09 Abr 2010, 02:55
por SatM
Hola Jose,

lo que pretendes hacer se puede realizar con una sola tarjeta, siempre que tenga controles de reproducción y grabación suficientes, en mi caso lo he usado también para decodificar morse con programas como el CwGet ( http://www.dxsoft.com ). Las tarjetas de sonido USB más simples no lo permiten (al faltarles los controles y la circuitería necesaria), pero, con las PCIs o USBs avanzadas, no habrá problema.

La forma de hacerlo, sin cables, será seleccionando (dependerá de la tarjeta de sonido y del nro de controles) en la parte de reproducción (webSDR) una salida (o control) que se se pueda buclear (internamente) a la parte de grabación, para explicarlo mejor he pegado unos pantallazos en el siguiente fichero adjunto ...

Espero que sirva de ayuda ..

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 09 Abr 2010, 07:47
por J.Luis
Gracias Satm :
Lo voy a intentar ,pero la SB USB que uso para este menester
no es nada del otro jueves.

Saludos y 73

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 11 Abr 2010, 02:36
por J.Luis
TEST with ROS EME on April 11
8 April, 2010 by José Alberto Nieto Ros
Next Sunday April 11, EME test with ROS EME.

144.160 MHZ (USB) ( 8:00-10:00 UTC)

Filter configuration:

TX Filter: From 1350 to 1700 Hz is enough (signal is from 1500 to 1564 Hz)

RX Filter: Don’t apply any RX filter with any ROS mode.

Unfortunately for the ARRL, ROS EME is a FSK of 16 tones with a Frequency Separation of 4 Hz (n=4) and a WideBand of 64 Hz. Legal in USA because a FSK of 16 tones is legal in USA, and ROS EME use just 16 tones.

This time ARRL cannot prohibit that USA Hams realize experiments with this new mode.

You can analyze this audio samples where you can see the 16 tones separated by 4 Hz.

Re: Modos Digitales y Difusos en HF / VHF / UHF / SHF ..

NotaPublicado: 15 Abr 2010, 08:02
por J.Luis
Manual de usuario para ROS en español disponible en:

http://www.mediafire.com/?nymbrhcmyjm